Ep. 366 The Evolution of “Girl Power” with Geri Halliwell-Horner

Written By Megan Caballero

This week, we’re joined by Geri Halliwell-Horner, also known as Ginger Spice from the Spice Girls. She's here to discuss Rosie Frost: Ice on Fire, the second book in her middle grade adventure series, about a girl learning the secrets of her family's history. Halliwell-Horner also shares her journey from pop music sensation to middle grade novelist, and how her relationship with the phrase, “girl power,” has changed over the years.

The Stacks Book Club pick for April is Blessing the Boats: New and Selected Poems 1988–2000 by Lucille Clifton. We will discuss the book on April 30th with Tiana Clark returning as our guest.

 
 

Everything we talk about on today’s episode can be found below in the show notes and on Bookshop.org and Amazon.

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TRANSCRIPT
*Due to the nature of podcast advertising, these timestamps are not 100% accurate and will vary.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 0:00

If we look up the word feminism, if you look it up, it actually says equality between the sexes. So whether whatever you identify with, you know whether it's girl boy or something else, it doesn't matter if that word girl power can evolve to inner power.

We all want to find our power. We all want to feel loved, don't we? We all want to feel, you know, the best version of who we can be.

And I think that's the most important message. That's a timeless message.

Traci Thomas 0:39

Welcome to the Stacks, a podcast about books and the people who read them. I'm your host, Traci Thomas, and today, I could not be more excited to welcome to the stacks. Geri Halliwell-Horner. Geri is an author, performer and pop culture icon, best known as Ginger Spice from the Spice Girls. Her latest book, Rosie Frost: Ice on fire is the second installment in her middle grade adventure series about a determined girl navigating a mysterious island school while uncovering secrets about herself and her past. Today, Geri and I talk about her evolution as a writer girl power and what it's meant for her to be an inspiration to young girls. Don't forget. Our book club pick for April is blessing the boats new and Selected Poems, 1988 through 2000 by Lucille Clifton. Tiana Clark, will be back on Wednesday, April 30 to discuss this book with me, so please be sure to read along and then tune in. Quick reminder, everything we talk about on each episode of the stacks can be found in the link in the show notes. And if you love this podcast and you want inside access to it, there are two ways you can support the stacks. One is by joining us over on Patreon, our bookish community known as the stacks pack, where you get bonus episodes, access to our Discord, our mega reading challenge and to be part of an incredible community of readers. The other way you can support is by subscribing to my unstacked newsletter. Over on substack, you get all my hot takes, plus bonus episodes and a lot of fun pop culture and book content. Go to Traci thomas.substack.com

and subscribe. Okay, now it is time for my conversation with Jerry Hallowell Horner. You all right, everybody. I'm so excited. I'm joined today by Jerry Hallowell Horner. You all may remember her from a little music group she was part of back in the 90s, the Spice Girls, but I know her from her two children's middle grade novels that sent her rosy frost. The latest one just came out yesterday. It's called rosy frost, ice on fire. Jerry, welcome to the stacks. Hello.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 2:50

Oh my god. It's so exciting to be here and then to hear you say the title of my book. I'm like, Oh my god. So it's like, thrilling, I'll tell you. It's like a dream come true. Well, I'm like something in your imagination, and then you suddenly get hear it. You're like, wow.

Traci Thomas 3:09

Okay, I have to know, why did you want to write these books? This book, what? How did this come to you? How did this even become a dream?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 3:18

Okay, so I started writing when, God, I've always loved the power of words and that, you know, Bri the band, I studied English literature, oh, and I always loved reading. It was always part of my love, my DNA and and then, before I put my love of words in songs. And then there was a period I read this book called The Artist Way okay, and it gets you to do lots of little practices of a series of like tasks. And then, and that's when I came up with my first book series, and that was called Eugenia lavender. And that did really well and but that was for much younger and then I thought, Well, shall I age her up? And then I was surprised by a very experienced agent. He said, No, start again. Start again. So then I thought, okay, I felt like the world needs a new hero, a different kind of hero, someone that was vulnerable and not perfect, and that we can all relate to, finding the courage you never knew you had. Yeah, and that's where it started from. And I'm always character LED. Okay, I love finding yourself and your friendships on you know, whether it's in movies or books. So yeah, now that's where it started from, and I thought it was character first.

Traci Thomas 4:56

I love that. Let's backtrack a hair and tell. People who aren't familiar with the book, what will you tell us in like 30 seconds or so, what Rosie frost, ice on fire is about?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 5:08

Okay, so Rosie Frost is a heartfelt action adventure. She is an orphan at this school, hever bridge on this island, bloodstone, which is like imagine Jurassic Park, but for endangered animals, and this and the school was built by Queen Elizabeth the first 500 years ago, but now it's current day, and Rosie frost, she just lost her mum. She's orphaned, and she's sent there, and she doesn't know why. She goes through a series of challenges. And now cut to she found out that her mother was murdered, right? And there's been a murder on the island, and she's like, she's trying to find out who the murderer is. She's full of, like, revenge on her mind, unanswered questions, and there's a little bit of love in there, yeah,

Traci Thomas 5:55

What I really like about Rosie, and what I like too much about the book, as you were saying, She's tough and she's like, gonna do she's gonna do it, but she's like, she's very tender. She's like, a very sweet girl who sort of is forced into this situation, as opposed to, I think so many young heroines are often, they're just tough as nails across the board. And I like that. Rosie has that balance of, like, she doesn't actually want to be doing this. She just wants to be texting her mom, pineapple. Pineapples, but instead she's out here, like solving murders and like dealing with weird animals and bullies. And I just, I really like that about her.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 6:32

Oh, that's something, because that's the point of her. She's modern most of us, the truth is, aren't we all sometimes a bit afraid, and we're going, how do I do this? I don't know the answers. And actually, Rosie, she's just like, Okay, I've got to have to make the best of this. And actually, the she, she finds a strength through the challenge, through the challenges raises as we do. And for me, it was important that you know the people around her, that you know the male characters are just as important, that you know they are reflection of modern day boys. Now, you know the boys once cry, but they're not wet wipes, you know, they're still strong and in well rounded.

Traci Thomas 7:18

Yeah, you have daughters, did they influence at all sort of your wanting to write these books and for this age group,

Geri Halliwell-Horner 7:27

I think so. I always just feel like it doesn't matter who we are or how old you are, we need to see ourselves in stories. We process stuff through stories, and whether it's on book or film. And I just kept on going. I followed the rules. There's four rules in book one that Anne Boleyn gives to her daughter, Queen Elizabeth. The first those four rules, I was actually when, God, I'm following those rules personally, you know, like, have courage united. We stand like I need you. And the third one is, never give up, you know. So there is a warning, I think, that comes with Book Two, pick it up, and I think it's quite hard to put down. More than like, it's quite page turnery, like, I want to know. I did it on purpose. I want to know next and next and next and next.

Traci Thomas 8:18

Yeah, it definitely has a page turner vibe, like from the beginning. I mean, something happens in a bathroom very early on, and you're just like, well, now I need to know who this is, where we're going, and why.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 8:30

I did it on purpose.

Traci Thomas 8:31

Were you a fantasy reader as a kid? Are you a fantasy reader as an adult? Where did this sort of genre come from? For you?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 8:38

I think this, I would put this genre as magical realism. Okay, a lot of everything you read is and not intentionally, but it's some of it is real. Yeah, there is a moment you're going to find out, I don't know if you've got to it yet, that Harry Arundel, he's one of the professors there. He is bringing animals from the past back to life, right, okay, and He reveals this real life dodo I thought, Oh, that would be interesting. So I made that it actually really is happening.

Traci Thomas 9:15

Someone's bringing back the dodo bird?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 9:16

And I know that, so it was sort of unintentional. So there is, it leans into science on this one. You know, there's black there's black hole, fusion energy, but it's sort of in the backdrop of it, and then it gets bigger. And so why do I go to this? I have a fascination. I'm quite a curious person. Okay? I would say, like, I like history a bit. I like a bit of science, like a bit of that, but I'm a bit nerdy, but I'm a lazy nerd, like, when I was researching and interviewing people, sometimes I like, can you say that again? You say that again? For sure, you know, when I was speaking to science. 90s. I was like, Oh, my goodness. But you know, it's just in the background of the story, so it just gives it the class. So what you see, what you read, there is elements of truth to it, but really, it actually, it's a fast pace, and it's murderous.

Traci Thomas 10:15

Yeah, yeah. I mean, it has, yes, it has those like elements. I'm so fascinated that you were like, in English. English was your sort of background in school has becoming an author changed your relationship to reading in any way? Oh, yeah, absolutely.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 10:32

It's funny. You say that it's a bit like as a musician. You can unpick music and go, I can hear how they did. I definitely it really, you can start analyzing how they've done this. However, a great story just sucks you in anyway. Okay, for example, I got recommended, just by accident to read the story Rebecca, okay, by by Daphne du Maurier, and that is how many 90 years old. Probably I was hooked in and so it's ageless. It's timeless. So you can enjoy anything. I'll enjoy any genre.

Traci Thomas 11:12

Like, what are other books you've loved? What are some of your faves?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 11:16

I would say, 20 years ago I loved The Book Thief, okay, yes, I thought was original and fantastic, and that was very transporting. It's got a historical value to it. I'll tell you what was a lean into entry point was the other Berlin girl. Oh, yeah. But then I recently, okay, I've talked about Tomorrow, Tomorrow, Tomorrow. That made me cry, and it didn't. I didn't think I was gonna love that. You know, it's about computer nerds. And then reset at the moment, my reading at the moment, okay, I'm reading, okay, Robert Harris, Precipice. He wrote Conclave.

Traci Thomas 11:55

Okay, oh yes, I just read that last year.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 11:57

But then also, and I'm trying to make myself read it because someone else says it and oh God, I'll show you this. Actually, the book this computer is rested on it, on your books.

Traci Thomas 12:06

Okay, what is that? War and Peace? Oh, you're doing it.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 12:12

Scrolling, oh, my god, okay, that's me. I've got two books on the go. Sometimes I have more. I'm I'm committed. I'm doing it. I don't care if it takes me all year, I am going to read this book. You can do it, yeah? So apparently you get into it. Sometimes, what they say, Yeah, I've never read it. Yeah, the same. I, you know, this is the first of, I think someone said it was a writer, screenwriter, said to me, I asked him, What's your favorite book? And he said, War and Peace. And it was, I thought, I'm gonna give him a go.

Traci Thomas 12:48

Okay, that's amazing.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 12:50

And it's got really small print, yeah, can I just tell you how many pages it's got? One? Oh, my God, it has got 1374 pages. 1000 like Rosie frost goes to 400 and something. And I thought, I'm demanding a lot of my readers. Maybe I shouldn't. No, you know.

Traci Thomas 13:14

it's only you had the ego of an old Russian you know, you would say Rosie needs another 1000 pages, easy diving.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 13:23

Is such a big ask, to ask a reader to commit, to really commit, to invest their time. It's the huge, yeah,

Traci Thomas 13:32

it is. I mean, so these Russian, the old Russian novels, like Anna, Karenina as well, they were serialized. So when they came out, they came out in parts. So you would get like a book at a time, so they were more like a series than here's 13,000 or 1300 pages. So at the time, it felt more like soap opera E now it just feels like homework.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 13:54

It's not interesting. Oh, I didn't know that. Okay, so do you get what was war and peace?

Traci Thomas 13:58

I think so, because that's also that's who's that? Tolstoy? Yeah, yeah. I think it was also serialized. I don't know for sure. Okay, I want to shift gears a little bit, because I first have to confess something, and then I want to talk about something else.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 14:14

I'm a priest.

Traci Thomas 14:16

No, I'm gonna confess. I'm gonna confess. Well, yes, I guess a pop culture priest. The Spice Girls was my first ever concert. Was it? I was a huge fan. I still am. Played it last night for my twins. They were loving stop right now. Thank you very much. They're five obsessed. Wouldn't stop singing it, my one kid loves now to go, stop right now. Thank you very much. I'm like, Okay, you're welcome. Very much, you little rude baby. But I was always, I was always a ginger. I look like a scary. I often got cast as a scary, but I had another black friend, and she got to be scary, and I got to be ginger. And I've always thought of myself as a ginger. So I am just, I have to just say I'm. Really, like, personally, my the inner child in me just so thrilled to have you here. I love, Oh, that's lovely, yeah, I mean, and I do want to ask you, actually, about fans and fandom, because I'm so interested in you. You know, the Spice Girls came out in the 90s, people my age, millennials, you all were so important to us when we were, you know, pre teens and teens, and you're sort of writing to that same age group now. So I'm wondering for you, if there's something that speaks to you about that kind of age, for young girls, that that like you really feel like you have something to say, or that you're able to connect with them in in a way that feels meaningful to you. Okay?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 15:44

It's funny, Ice on Fire. It talks the the premises, the genesis of it. It says 14 is the age of power, okay. Now different periods in our life we can suddenly, it's almost like shedding a skin or, you know, we step into a new phase. And it really is that, I think it's a different era. You suddenly go, this is my identity. I'm owning it. I think that happens at 14. It happens again at 30, you know, and older, it's just another era and and reclaiming that. And it says there have been Queens at the age of 14 and, and I think, you know, we're we're impressionable. We're sort of looking for answers that we're evolving at all ages. We are, you know, if I can see it, we can be it. So I love speaking to, actually, any generation, but if I can speak to a younger one, great. But I think I really feel that this book is, you know, if you're 27 you connect the my job, my ambition is, yes, it will speak to you if you're 14 or 10, but also if you're 2737 and 57 doesn't matter. So timeless subject of going your heart is on fire, and sometimes we are ice on fire. You know, it's both. We are both. Sometimes we like full of revenge and angry, and then sometimes we're full of passion. It's we're all of that.

Traci Thomas 17:20

Yeah, have you heard from your younger readers from the first book? How did their experience with the book sort of impact you as you were working on the second one?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 17:30

Oh, my goodness, it's so thrilling. And you know when readers come up to me and say, I really liked, you know, otterly, or I can't stand that hemlock. Wait till you see what happens in number two, in rise, ice on fire. Oh, my God, the behavior. And actually, even Rosie, she, her behavior is questionable, that there is a darkness in all of us, and it's whether we we notice it and recognizing, um, who've done that a bit better. She sort of does she there is no one where you go really, little bit Brittany esque. Okay, we love it in the snake. It's the snake and she does something that's quite it's the, I call it the Ricochet of revenge. And it can happen in anyone's walk of life. You know, I can say, Traci, you really annoyed me. And so yeah. And now I'm going to do this back and then, and then, and then, Traci, you go, Jerry, you really annoyed me, right? I'm now I'm going to, and it just goes a ricochet and forth, and it's and that resentment builds. Or I can say, Do you know? I'm just gonna let it go. Let it go doesn't mean I'm a doormat, but maybe I'm gonna let this go. It asks those questions of ourself, you know, when things don't go well, how am I gonna respond? You know? And Rosie is full of like, She's full of absolute anger and resentment. Her mother has been killed, yeah?

Traci Thomas 19:05

And grief, I mean, this is sort of, I mean, these are grief books.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 19:09

Yeah, it's about grief. The underpinning, there is a running theme throughout all the books and the characters, relationships with our mums. You know, it's our first interaction, whether it's a good one or a bad one, you know, whether it colors are, you know, our being. I didn't realize laugh was. I was like, gosh, you really lean into that. Someone else pointed it out. And you really all the, all the, you know, characters, even the new ones all have, some are shaped by their mothers.

Traci Thomas 19:43

Yeah. I mean, aren't we all our fathers? Yeah, aren't we all? Aren't we all? Yeah, the theme of, you know, girl power sort of runs through this book, right? And I'm wondering why you think that's still, if, if you think that's still. Girl is a resonant theme, and why, and also how your relationship has changed to the idea of girl power as feminism has changed so much over the last 30 years.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 20:10

If we look up the word feminism, if you look it up, it actually says equality between the sexes. So whether whatever you identify with, you know, whether it's girl boy or something else, it doesn't matter me, that everybody matters. And actually, if that word girl power can evolve to inner power, you know, unless we all want to find our power, yeah, whether it's through that courage, whether it's through love, we all want to feel love, don't we? We all want to feel, you know, the best version of who we can be, the truth we will live in our truths. And I think that's the most important message that and that's a runnings, that's a timeless message, yeah.

Traci Thomas 20:59

Okay, let's take a quick break and we'll be right back. Okay, great, we're back. How do you name your characters? How did you come up with all these people?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 21:11

Oh, that's so interesting. Okay, so there is a there, okay, so there's a new dude in this called Ludo. And I found I just meet people. I met a guy called luja. Oh, you did. Oh, yeah. And this guy that I, I know, I don't know him. Well, he was going out with an otterly. And I kept it, I banked it, um, we think there were actually people that I go, Oh, that's good. Always collecting little Magpie, Rosie. She, she just that came. You knew it was Rosie, instantly. Yeah, yeah. I'm saying I played around, actually, with her surname. But then I really love the idea that Rosie frost this sort of, this sort of parallel of both the mirror, wow, and she's both.

Traci Thomas 21:56

What was the hardest part of writing the book?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 22:00

Okay? This is something I've had to learn. Is discipline of threading. The second go I wrote out more of the the timeline, the theme of it, structure, before I began. I And that's, that's a discipline. Another author show told me to do that the first time around. You know, some authors, there's no right or wrong way. Some authors just go on their trail adventure. But the book too, I did it more structured, and actually it helped me, because you can still be creative, but it just gives you some boundaries. I think, what was the hard? I think editing is really hard. Yeah, get all these notes, and it's like, oh my god, there's different levels there.

Traci Thomas 22:48

Yeah, have you ever heard the phrase plotting or pantsing?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 22:54

First Book I did pants pantsing. The first book I did pantsing. Second book I did plotting, yes,

Traci Thomas 23:04

and for people who are like, what does that mean, pantsing is flying by the seat of your pants when you write, whereas plotting is like, you have an outline, or you lay things out, you plot it out, you have a plan. Did you ever want to stop writing or throw the book away and just be like, it's a one, it's one book. I don't want to do the second one.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 23:20

Always knew that it was three. Yeah, I always knew it was three.

Traci Thomas 23:25

Have you started writing book three yet?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 23:27

I've literally, yes, I have. I'm I'm doing, I've doing the, the whole outline, and I've started to really like home, down to, you know it knows what it is now, and I've got my aha moment. I tell you what I do do, like, about it when you have to get go on the research trips, yeah? Like, I interviewed Brian Cox, who's a physicist, okay, like, and then they're sharing their experience with you. It's amazing, yeah? I mean, you know, for the book lovers, I mentioned Philippa, Gregory, like so I met her when I first started, maybe 17 years ago, and then she gave me, like, a quote. It's on, it's on the English version. It's not an American one yet. But she gave, she gave me a strap line. She read it of Ice and Fire, and then she was in my kitchen and giving me tips, you know, and point on Henry the eighth. And I was like, Oh, my God. Oh my god. The door openers for me into historical fiction is now in my kitchen. Yeah.

Traci Thomas 24:40

I mean, that's like, the coolest thing about how life works, right?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 24:43

Isn't it brilliant?

Traci Thomas 24:45

But that's how I feel right now talking to you.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 24:48

You know what? We all inspire each other at different times, don't we? Yeah, we're all like, pulling each other over the wall, yeah. I think, you know, we inspire each other at different times. Is, you know, everybody has something shining within them that, you know, wants to come through. And sometimes we just need that encouragement.

Traci Thomas 25:09

Yeah? And the space, yeah.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 25:12

That, yeah, the space, the real, like, key opener for creativity. You know what it is allow oneself to be bored just or a little bit like not preoccupied or consistently stimulated from the outside, but allow the inside to come through, but that means allowing space.

Traci Thomas 25:34

Yeah. Do you know who Twyla Tharp is, the choreographer? No, so she's amazing, and and she has a book called The creative habit that came out when I was in college, and it's still one of the most important books for me. I reread it so often, but one of the things she always talks about is how she always starts in an empty, white, clean, white room, because she needs that, that like nothing, no input, which is sort of what you're talking about. And I always say, you know, I have my best ideas in the shower because I have no phone, I have no music, I have no nothing to write with. I just have my brain, and I'm just, like in there, and that is where, you know, if I'm, if I'm working on an interview and I'm stuck on a question, or how do I want to ask this? Or what do I want to talk about with this person, I'll be in the shower, and then all of a sudden, like, Oh, that's it. That's it. So I do, I agree. I think there's something too that no no input, kind of boredom.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 26:32

Yeah, I suppose it's a I'm learning. It's that infinite wisdom from within. It's in us all. You know that we have all the answers the truth all inside of us and allowing it and to access it, to give ourselves the space to hear it, rather than stuffing it with, you know, constant activity, yeah, distraction, and when the truth is in us, oh, and allowing that sort of beauty and truth, it's maybe to come through, yeah.

Traci Thomas 27:08

And like being open to to hearing it or sensing what's getting out.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 27:13

Yeah, and then being brave enough to act on it, yeah,

Traci Thomas 27:17

well, that part's really hard. That's, that's the hardest part of being creative, I think, is like being willing to put the work out into the world, right? Like to like, be able to actually say, I made this. What do you think? Yes.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 27:33

And somewhere I read this saying, and there's two things that said, failure is feedback. And bail, well. And it was in, do you know, I was in something really small, where I read this. It was dog man, do you know dog man? Oh, yeah.

Traci Thomas 27:50

The like, police dog, yeah. Cartoon book?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 27:53

A cartoon book. And I was just reading it with my son, and they were talking about, you know, they're going to be creative. And everyone was a bit frightened to be creative. And then you went, Okay, I want you to do I want you to create a story, a cartoon, but I want you to think I'm going to fail as I do it. Yes, really outlandish, like you think, Oh my goodness. But actually without freedom to just Yeah, I go for it no matter what.

Traci Thomas 28:26

Yeah, this is a real hard shift, but I always ask everybody about this, and we're coming to the end of our time. So how do you write? How often, how many hours a day Is there music or no? Are you home? Are you in the world? Are there snacks and beverages that part's important.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 28:44

Different things, as I've gone long, and for me, there isn't a right way to do it, and there's different things. Okay? And other writers have told shared their experience. The first thing was to leave the phone outside the room. Okay, the phone is a creative killer, because turn off notifications from your laptop, because otherwise it pulls you out, yeah, and then you're distracted. That's one definitely set date, like time and because otherwise we can go, oh, I need to go and do this. I need to go that. No, isn't when you feel like it. You're going to be at the desk at nine o'clock till 12 o'clock. That's it. That is your time. Doesn't matter, whatever, even if you write one sentence, that's your time. And then sometimes I've got out of bed in the middle of the night and just felt I just wanted to write something. Yeah, I write notes all the time, you know, to myself, I think all that's a really good

Traci Thomas 29:43

On paper or on your phone?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 29:47

Thoughts on my phone now, but I've written things on the back of you know what this is? Yeah, I'm going to share it on an airplane. I've written ideas on. The back of a sick bag, you know?

Traci Thomas 30:02

Yeah. What about writing snacks and beverages? Any?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 30:07

Yeah, I normally use that as break sometimes every 20 minutes if on my head is like, going to get a, you know, have a drink or go and have a cup of tea. And the other thing I would say as well is keep sending what I've written, sending it on email to myself, Oh, yeah, because you want to save it, because imagine if your computer crashes. Yeah, yeah. I see horrible feeling.

Traci Thomas 30:33

Be prepared for anything. The other question I always ask is, what's a word you can never spell correctly on the first try?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 30:40

Do you know what? Sometimes I like I think, I don't know if it's because the phone writes for you. Sometimes I get you can get a mental block on spelling, like I went to write the word lenses today, like for your glasses. Yes, lenses, or lens, I second guessed myself.

Traci Thomas 31:05

This is a word I also can't spell, because I think it should be L-E-N-S-E. Yes, and what is that's what I think. I think it's L-E-N-S Right, like a lens. I don't know I can. I have a really hard time with this wrong I'm looking it up right now, lens, l e n s is a lens for a glasses for glasses is L e n s e a word. No, l e n s e is not a word. But I have you're not alone. This is a this is one I never remember whenever anybody asks me words I can't spell, but it is one that I have struggled with for a long time. Lens.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 31:39

So actually I text someone word lens, as in straight down the lens, and I've spelled it wrong.

Traci Thomas 31:47

See, amazing. We love we love bad spelling here. I'm a terrible speller. So check, yeah, I need spell check too. In life, like any I always think about school teachers who write on the board. I'm like, if you're a bad speller, you're just opening yourself up to the kids, just making so much fun of you.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 32:08

But I think because we've got spell check now, you know, we can be get a little bit, yeah, we rely on it. Rely on it. So we become a little bit on that.

Traci Thomas 32:21

Yeah, well, I can say confidently that while I'm definitely a bad speller. Now, I was also a bad speller as a child. I've, for some reason, it just does not stick in my brain. I just refuse to remember,

Geri Halliwell-Horner 32:34

yeah, sometimes it doesn't sound as it doesn't look right.

Traci Thomas 32:38

It doesn't sound right. Very phonetic. So anything, if there's, like, a lot of consonants, I get it wrong because I just, I'm like, how many M's, how many C's, I don't know. Um, anyways, successful. That's hard. Too many, too I think that's a lot of doubles. I don't know. But not at the end. I think there's only L at the end,

Geri Halliwell-Horner 32:57

Two collars, two socks.

Traci Thomas 32:59

Oh, doing it two collars, two socks. But what has, what has two collars? Like two socks makes sense. Because you have two feet, you need two socks, but I only have one neck. So shouldn't it be one collar, two socks?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 33:13

That's how I've remembered it, two colors.

Traci Thomas 33:16

I clearly am misunderstanding the the memory device, but, or making maybe making it too literal. Well, since we're almost out of time, I just have about two more questions for you. One is for people who love these books, what are some other books that you might recommend to them that are in conversation with the Rosie Frost series?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 33:35

It's not trying to be the same, because I think so Harry Potter, obviously, is a is a story about a kid that is sent to a school. Yeah, that is a similarity. But here we've got a female protagonist, and is about the power within, yeah. So that is a similarity. I can't think of anything that's similar. Can you think of anything I would say it's an, um, it's un airbrushed, yeah? Is an un airbrushed adventure, which, for me, is very modern, like, you'll feel that, you'll feel Rosie's pain, yeah?

Traci Thomas 34:16

I mean, I sort of, I mean, maybe because I've been reading these books recently too, but she sort of has some Katniss Everdeen in her, some Hunger Games in her.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 34:23

Okay, there was a little bit of that. But the difference is, I would say she's more vulnerable. Yeah, she hasn't quite, um, she's having to find the courage. Yeah, I'm not sure.

Traci Thomas 34:38

But they're in conversation. They're sort of in the same, the same kind of like figuring it out, having to be tough when they don't necessarily want to be. I mean, the stories are very different, the worlds are different, but there's something in there.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 34:54

There is a little bit of that catness, a little bit, but there's a little bit of love. In there, but then it's wrapped in conservation and but the love and the human relationships isn't there. I don't know what else there is that's good.

Traci Thomas 35:15

You answered.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 35:18

It's Gladiator.

Traci Thomas 35:20

Yes, I love that. That's great. That's great. That's actually really funny. I'm like, picturing like, Regina, George and George Clooney, like going head to head. Is it George Clooney? No, who is it? It's the other Russell Crowe, the other guy who looks like George Clooney. Don't cut that. Christian people know I'm so bad at so many celebrities, I can never make you

Geri Halliwell-Horner 35:45

quite um again likable, because we're all that.

Traci Thomas 35:50

I can never remember. I only, I can only remember JerryGeri Halliwell-Horner, the only celebrity that ever mattered to me.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 35:56

Thank you so much, and thank you for being ginger. Yeah, ginger, and Rosie is Ginger on the hair color, but actually, Ginger actually means, like, when She gingerly did something, she's like, I'm gonna, like, careful, go for it. It's a spirit within.

Traci Thomas 36:14

Do you still feel like ginger, or do you feel like a totally different person?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 36:18

I this within us all. We're all just different layers, aren't we?

Traci Thomas 36:22

Yeah, I just think about like, being known for something like, from so many years before. Like, if you feel like you like, I'm obviously you've grown and you've changed. But like, to so many people, you're this, like 20 something, and I wonder if you still see yourself in that girl.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 36:39

I think we just evolve. You know, your podcast is seven years old. Yeah. And we evolve. We grow. It's natural. There's the essence of us that you know remain. You know, that's part of life, isn't it?

Traci Thomas 36:54

Yeah, it is okay. Last question, if you could have one person dead or alive read this book, who would you want it to be?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 37:02

Anne Boleyn?

Traci Thomas 37:03

Oh, good one. Yeah.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 37:06

For sure, because it's almost her redemption or Queen Elizabeth. But this was my like, you know, this was her rebrand, yeah? This was her rebrand that she deserves to be heard.

Traci Thomas 37:18

Yeah? She could. She gets a bad right in history?

Geri Halliwell-Horner 37:21

Yeah. I think, Oh, do you know what she was here now, I'd say, You know what? Girl? We hear you, we see you. You are married to a pig, right? And we love you, okay? And we're rebranding you and your daughter, Queen Elizabeth, abuzz. You are fantastic, too. Slay you.

Traci Thomas 37:40

Yeah. I love it. I love it. That's a perfect place to end. Geri, thank you so much for being here. This was just amazing. Thank you.

Geri Halliwell-Horner 37:49

Okay, well, thank you so much. And congratulations on seven years of this podcast, and you've done amazing. And a big hello and thank you to everyone listening, Have a beautiful day. And yeah, you've got this.

Traci Thomas 38:05

And everyone else, we will see you in the Stacks.

All right, y'all that does it for us. Thank you so much for listening. And thank you again to Jerry Hallowell Horner for joining the show. Thank you also to Emma Eales and Emma Pelz for helping to make this conversation possible. Remember, our book club pick for April is Blessing the Boats by Lucille Clifton, which we will discuss on Wednesday, April 30 with Tiana Clark. If you love this podcast and you want inside access to it, head to patreon.com/the stacks and join the stacks pack and you can check out my newsletter at Traci thomas.substack.com make sure you're subscribed to the stacks, wherever you listen to your podcasts, and if you're listening through Apple podcasts or Spotify, please leave us a rating and a review for more from the stacks. Follow us on social media @thestackspod on Instagram, threads and Tiktok, and check out our website, thestackspodcast.com this episode of the stacks was edited by Christian Duenas, with production assistance from Megan Caballero and Wy'Kia Frelot. Our graphic designer is Robin McCreight, and our theme music is from Tagirijus. The Stacks is created and produced by me Traci Thomas. You.

Megan Caballero
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