Ep. 322 I Think Voicy is Great with Melissa Mogollon

Written By Megan Caballero
Ep. 322 I Think Voicy is Great with Melissa Mogollon.jpg

Today we are speaking with Melissa Mogollon about her debut novel Oye, a tragicomic family drama told in a series of one-sided phone calls from one sister to another. Melissa shares her approach to writing a book all in dialogue, and what it was like to write from a teenager’s POV. We also talk about the term "voicy" and whether or not it is a pejorative.

The Stacks Book Club selection for June is It Ends with Us by Colleen Hoover. We will discuss the book on June 26th with Melissa Mogollon.

 
 

Everything we talk about on today’s episode can be found below in the show notes and on Bookshop.org and Amazon.

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TRANSCRIPT
*Due to the nature of podcast advertising, these timestamps are not 100% accurate and will vary.

Traci Thomas 0:08

Welcome to The Stacks, a podcast about books and the people who read them. I'm your host Traci Thomas and today we are joined by debut author Melissa Mogollon, whose new book is Oye. Oye is a coming of age story with an inventive format. It's all told in a series of one-sided phone calls from our 18 year-old protagonist Luciana to her older sister Mari. It's a dynamic family drama in the midst of an approaching hurricane and it is as moving as it is hilarious. Melissa and I talked today about how she came up with this format, writing dialogue and of course, the many many books she has loved in her life. Remember the Stacks book club pick for June is It Ends with Us by Colleen Hoover. We will be discussing the book on Wednesday, June 26th with Melissa Mogollon. Okay, now it's time for my conversation with Melissa Mogollon.

All right, everybody. I'm so excited. I am here today with Melissa Mogollon who is the author of Oye. She is a debut author. She also works in a school, which we're going to talk about because I have questions. The book is really fun. And in reading the book and seeing how fun it was. I was like, Yes, this person must come on the podcast because they must be fun, because the book is fun. So with all that said, Melissa, welcome to The Stacks.

Melissa Mogollon 2:35

I can't wait to be here. I'm honored to be introduced as fun.

Traci Thomas 2:39

I think you're fun. You know what? That's a lot of pressure. So don't let it let the people down.

Melissa Mogollon 2:43

You know. I'm here, ready to deliver, hopefully.

Traci Thomas 2:48

And I will give you a rating at the end, on a scale of one to 10 How fun you ended up being. How much of this book is a lie? Okay, before we even dive into the book, tell the folks a little bit about yourself. I gave a sort of half assed professional resume. But I'd love to know a little bit about like, where you're from, what you're into where you live, now, all of that.

Melissa Mogollon 3:08

So my name is Melissa, like you said. I'm from Colombia was born in Gardena and Cordoba and I moved to South Florida when I was six years old. So I grew up there. I feel very Floridian for better for worse than I now live in Rhode Island. And I'm a teacher. I teach full I work full time at a boarding school. I'm an actor. I'm in an administration this year. So it's a whole other kind of view of the school. Yeah, but I get I go back to teaching creative writing next year, and I'm very excited about it. I love kids. I love education. I love to have fun. And being from South Florida Miami area, you know, I do. I love loud, fun people. And I tried to put that in the book. I used to live in LA I moved here from LA.

Traci Thomas 3:56

Oh really? I live in LA. And I've been to Colombia. And I've been to South Florida and my brother went to Brown. So I'm familiar with Rhode Island as well.

Melissa Mogollon 4:06

Wow. Brown is like the only cool Ivy.

Traci Thomas 4:09

That's what they say. But I always talk shit to him that I'm like, Oh, well, sorry, you didn't get into Harvard. I'm like Brown might be good. People might like it there. But it's not Princeton or whatever.

Melissa Mogollon 4:20

Is he artsy?

Traci Thomas 4:22

No, okay, not at all. He's just a smart person. He's great. He's like, my favorite person on the face of the earth. But also he didn't get into Harvard. I actually think he did get into Princeton and chose not to go. So I think that the I think that I can only say Harvard and Yale. I don't think I can dig on Princeton. However, all that being said, I loved Columbia. Where'd you go? I went to kartha hain. And I loved it. I mean, it's just vacation so who knows? But I had a lovely time. I ate delicious food. It was just beautiful. And it was a great vacation. I don't know obviously different than being from a place.

Melissa Mogollon 4:58

No, no, I mean, I think people I love it. I love visiting.

Traci Thomas 5:01

So do you get to go back often?

Melissa Mogollon 5:03

Not with my full time schedule right now at school, but I used to I used to go back often, like every year and

Traci Thomas 5:09

Do you have lots of family still there?

Melissa Mogollon 5:11

I do. I do. And then I also have lots of family in Florida.

Traci Thomas 5:16

Okay. Let's talk about the book. So the book is the story of Luciana and her grandmother sort of, they're like Co-protagonists. But the story is really told from Luciana's perspective, all through phone calls. It's all dialogue. About halfway through the book, I was like, wait, holy shit, this book is all dialogue. And every writer I've ever talked to is like, I hate writing dialogue. And you were like, nope, here you go. Here's 324 pages of dialogue.

Melissa Mogollon 5:52

They're wrong. Dialogue is the most fun. Obviously, I took the obsession too far. Clearly like,

Traci Thomas 5:59

Yeah, you went with it.

Melissa Mogollon 6:00

Yeah I went, I really leaned in. No dialogue to me is like I like the constraints of dialogues. I think it does push me to be the best writer I can be. And also, realistically, voicing humans is just so much fun. And I don't think a lot of people do it. Right. So it was also a flex for me, because I was like, I do dialogue. Well, so watch out for 336 pages.

Traci Thomas 6:19

Why do you think it makes you a better writer being able to write dialogue?

Melissa Mogollon 6:23

Well, not dialogue, but like the the limits of anything like even the constraints of genre or form or anything having sometimes like those limitations. For example, the limits of this format did push me to have to edit more and think more intentionally and thoughtfully with my words and how to like economy of words. And it just made me polish it up faster than just their rules. So I had to think more.

Traci Thomas 6:45

Was the book always straight dialogue or like, it's really I mean, it's not like it's monologue is what it is. But was it always like a monologue? Or was there a version of this book where it was like, and then she went outside and close the car door and called her sister?

Melissa Mogollon 7:00

Oh, my God, it gives me hives to think about that. Yes, it was always this was the original format. But then I tried the first 100 pages in many different ways. I had it in third person, first person I had Mari talking, I had the grandma talking, I had a whole bunch of things, but no one was doing it. Like Luciana, I just had the most fun when she was just ripping off. So I went back to the original format, and that's what we landed on.

Traci Thomas 7:24

I read in the acknowledgments that you have brothers, but you don't have sister, but this book is Sister to Sister and it's all about sisters. Everyone in the book as a sister, I guess the dad probably is somebody's brother, maybe but like we don't, yeah, and I guess the mom, the mom has blood brothers.

Melissa Mogollon 7:39

Yeah, I have two brothers. They are my life and my everything. I'm obsessed with them. But I always wanted a sister. I'm the oldest so I also wanted an older sister to kind of help guide me through everything. So I started writing this book because I wanted a sister and I was like, what is it? What does it feel like to have someone to call so I got to like feel that through being Luciana. But I realized what I ended up creating was like my demon little sister of my dreams. Luciana. And I'm so much more like mighty looking back. I think I'm kind of but they're both like my, my split personalities, I think.

Traci Thomas 8:17

I love it. Because Mari is like, sort of like the goody goody bag. But she's also a little bit of a little ho. At least according to Luciana. She's like in college. She's like, you know, doing her homework, getting good grades like doing diabetes fundraising. I don't know. She's active. And then Luciana is still in high school. She's 18. The book starts with her and her mom and they're fleeing a hurricane that's supposed to hit South Florida. It's yeah, South Florida. West Palm is South Florida. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I don't know my Florida geography that well, but I did recognize a few places. And so she and she's like, fucking up in school. She is. She got no friends. She's got one friend. She's obsessed with her grandma. They're best friends. But she's sort of like the family fuckup she's a little chubby. Her mom's on her about that, though. That was a little confusing, because I was like, maybe she's actually not chubby. Maybe the mom is just a psycho. Like, you could read it a few ways.

Melissa Mogollon 9:22

You nailed it. Reality doesn't matter.

Traci Thomas 9:26

Exactly. I mean, we're talking to an 18 year old girl. I'm like, Who knows what's going on her. She's also she's also she is out to some of her friends and her sister that she is a lesbian, but not everybody in the family. So that's like also part of the story. I guess. I guess. That's not a question that was just me telling you about the book that you wrote. I don't know if you know, that's what the books about but that's what it's about. The book is she's 18, Did you feel like you had to make a decision about making this an adult book or a why a book? Did that ever come up in the conversation? With your publisher or with your team?

Melissa Mogollon 10:03

It was never a decision of what it was it was always clear for me that I wanted it to be a coming of age, just adult regular fiction. But we were worried about potentially the marketing of it, we really wanted to be careful about how it was advertised and how it was marketed because we do have this technically she's an adult, I guess, but a teenage narrator. But then, I was really nervous of all the cursing too. And, and the the content, they were like, well, because the content recovers pretty adult and mature. Just because being delivered by a kid, I think we're gonna be fine. So I think it was mostly my agent and I were a little bit more worried. And everyone else at the publishing house was like, No, there's not ever going to be a thing. So don't worry.

Traci Thomas 10:43

That's so interesting. Yeah, I feel like I mean, you know, we talked about this a lot. All of that is just like marketing. And I think Leila Motley calls it genre redlining, sort of just like bullshit. But I do think like with this book, especially with how it starts, it starts off really fun and light, and then it gets into some like deeper, heavier things. But for the first like 100 pages, it easily could be like, you can easily give this to a teenager and love it. I mean, I think you could give it to an 18 year old or anyone. I don't I think like a young adult could read it. And yeah, like Yeah, I was reading about dark shit at like, yeah, team, so I'm sort of like, okay.

Melissa Mogollon 11:23

And did you ever read the Ellen Hopkins books, like Cranks?

Traci Thomas 11:28

No, I didn't read kids stuff. I read only adult stuff as a kid. Because I like nonfiction. And I've always liked nonfiction. And they don't really be making nonfiction books. Like for they do a little bit now. But like, when I was coming up, it was either like, I don't know, Sweet Valley High. Or like, here's a book on World War Two.

Melissa Mogollon 11:51

Like a biography of someone. Yeah.

Traci Thomas 11:54

There's no like, Here's a young adult version of the Holocaust. Like I didn't have that. I was just deep in like, the text. But I did. I sort of like, I sort of felt weird for me kind of being with like an 18 year old. I haven't really hung out with any 18 year olds. recently. I have small kids. I was like, is this? Is this what they're like?

Melissa Mogollon 12:15

No, no, listen. Definitely. So it's, I have found it interesting. The books only been out for us today, one day. So book's been out for a week and a day today. And I have in my very limited experience with the life of the book, I have found already, like a range of reactions when I meet people, and we talk about it. And I noticed that, like a lot, we're in New England, so a lot of my co workers, you know, they're from here. And so they're, they're pretty much they're all white, and not all of them, but most of them are and they're like, yeah, she's she's wow, like she's talking about just gonna like, she's just a lot. Like, they just like, make gestures. Like, she's a lot. There's a lot going on. And I'm like, yeah, yeah, like, Welcome to Miami like this. And then I did like a talk last night with a bunch of like Latinos and a Latinx group of young girls. And they're like, this is just like, my family like they were they just totally embraced it. And it Yeah, and I always knew that was gonna happen, but really seeing the, like, seeing it in person. I was like, Oh, well, some people think this is like magical realism and other people think this is just a standard Tuesday in my household.

Traci Thomas 13:20

Some people think it's magical realism, just because like you're from Colombia. I know. Like, that's like literally, it's like, like, do they call her spicy? Oh, yeah, of course. Yeah. Like, it's like, some of these things are just like, we call that racism or like, racial prejudice. We're gonna be generous. Like magical realism.

Melissa Mogollon 13:41

I did have someone asked, like, Was it difficult to have to voice- go back. I'm 30. So to go back in time and voice a kid and I was like, Oh, my God, I did not realize until you told me that it should have been difficult, but it was not at all it was easy. It was so much fun. I think that's why I had so much fun writing it because I got to behave badly to this other tiny person that you know, was saying and doing stuff. I didn't. But it was a blast. And I think everyone should go force a teenager for a bit.

Traci Thomas 14:09

But I'm, I feel like most people wouldn't be able to. I don't know. I don't know. Like you spend time with teenagers. So you probably have like a sense of like, what teenagers are like, and I think a lot of people who don't have teenagers or haven't had teenagers recently and are older, like haven't been a teenager in a long time, which struggle to like authentically bring a teenager to life I feel like that's what's cool about what you did is I'm like yeah, no I fuck with Luciana but like, also, she seems like she's I really don't want to spend too much time with her but I would definitely like hang out with her once or twice.

Melissa Mogollon 14:43

Yeah yeah, I mean, I think I'm pretty sassy. I'm from Colombia. And I'm from Miami like that's impossible to erase out of me so wherever I am, I'm very I don't mean to be sassy but I'm just myself and it code sassy often as we know, otherwise known as racism sometimes. Yeah, but so I do think that those characteristics get coded as kids like kids or sassy kids have added Sure. So my regular attitude when I talk was quite easy to tap into creating a character that so some people might think that was difficult in reality, like I'm just from Florida.

Traci Thomas 15:16

I just from Florida, I too am sassy. And I too have a big personality. So I feel like I also was like, hello, protagonist. Hello person I can relate to. Also something that Luciana and I share is a love for Grey's Anatomy. Do you also love Grey's Anatomy?

Melissa Mogollon 15:36

Yes. And there were so much more Grey's Anatomy references in there and I was like, I have to I have to relax like one is enough. But ya know, I love Grey's Anatomy so much.

Traci Thomas 15:46

I love it so much. There's a we I won't spoil anything for people at home who haven't read this yet. But there's a scene where someone has like a medical situation. And Luciana is like, I don't even know what this is placed on Grey's Anatomy, Grey's Anatomy, and I was literally like, I also know what this procedure is because of Grey's. Well, at first when the procedure came up before they said, Grey's Anatomy, I was like, I know this from Grey's Anatomy. And then I was like, Thank you for also knowing this from grey's.

Melissa Mogollon 16:10

I feel like I know the exact episode too. I mean, I know it came up multiple times. But there's one specific episode like I can even see the whiteboard. They're all like trying to talk about it and move the procedure.

Traci Thomas 16:18

Yeah. And I also like love that a teenager loves the show. Because I feel like that was a thing that happened during the pandemic. Yeah, it's like, people went back to watch it. And I was like, Oh, you guys are just watching this for the first time. Like, I've seen that episode. 75 times like weird that you don't know every word yet. Yeah, yeah. Um, who's your favorite Grey's Anatomy person?

Melissa Mogollon 16:43

I mean, let's go to the opposite. I found I did find Meredith Grey insufferable. And always, not always, but she was just very self centered, like her view is like this quite often. I mean, Cristina Yang is just like the classic, obviously.

Yeah, iconic.

I mean, there were so many. But I was like obsessed with Christina. Obsessed.

Traci Thomas 17:08

Yeah same. Yeah, I'll tell you, you'll appreciate this. So I used to teach Fitness here in Los Angeles. And one of my regular writers was Justin Chambers, aka Alex Karev. Oh, he was such a nice guy. He was my pal. But I called him my boyfriend, not to his face, but behind his back every day, like my boyfriend's in class. But one day, he came to class with Sandra Oh. And I set her up on her bicycle, a little spin bike. And I was like, I'm Traci, nice to meet you. What's your name? And she was like, I'm Sandy. And I was like, Oh, I actually am passed away. This is the greatest day of my life. I think she was fine. She sat in the back. She She kept being like, I'm gonna be terrible at this. Like, you know, Justin made me do this. I'm gonna be terrible, whatever. But I literally was like, This is amazing. But also who used to ride totally separately was Eva remember his like girlfriend, Eva, who was from the boat accident, who was like Jane Doe for a long time and she had like the fucked up face, and then they like did-? That actress she used to also come all the time. And I was like, Do you guys know that you're both here at the same time? Like do you wanna rekindle?

Melissa Mogollon 18:22

That is amazing. I also just love that Justin and Sandra were like taking fitness class together.

Traci Thomas 18:28

Yeah. This was like after she was off the show. His was when he was still on. Anyways, sorry, everyone. You needed to know.

Melissa Mogollon 18:37

Yeah, that I worked at Disney Studios in Burbank for a home when I lived in LA. And so since Disney owns ABC, they showed me her Meredith Grey's lab coat one time that they have there for months, and I freaked out. So I went to an event and she was seated at the table next to being with Sean. And I was like, they said they my my boss is like, Mel, we need to come. We need to hear from your mouth that you're not going to cry when you see her. If not, we can't send you to the event. I was like, ok I can do this.

Traci Thomas 19:04

Wait, what did you do for Disney?

Melissa Mogollon 19:06

I worked in corporate communications. So drama and writing.

Traci Thomas 19:11

Wow. And Did you always know you wanted to be a writer?

Melissa Mogollon 19:16

Um, no, I loved it. I didn't think it was a career or possibility. And then I had a professor in college say, sit me down and say if this is something you want to do, there are things called MFA programs that can really help you. Some are fully funded, some are partially funded. You don't need to take the GRE just apply, you idiot. And so I did. And and I got it. And so I went straight there and going to Iowa really changed my life. I think it was a defining moment where I was like, I think I can do this. And I think I want to do this so.

Traci Thomas 19:46

And Iowa's a fancy one.

Melissa Mogollon 19:48

Iowa's a fancy one. Very lucky. Yeah.

Traci Thomas 19:51

Did you have fancy people in your class with you like other people that I would know whose books have come out?

Melissa Mogollon 19:57

well my really good friend Kylie Reid.

Traci Thomas 20:00

she was in your same class?

Melissa Mogollon 20:02

She was a year below me. So I was there a year before her and then we overlapped Her first year. My second year. Yeah.

Traci Thomas 20:08

I did a live event with Kylie this year. She's great.

Melissa Mogollon 20:12

She's the best. We really. I mean, as you know, Iowa can be very- I had a wonderful experience, but definitely people take themselves very seriously there. So I would like to idiots Hello, literally. Anyways, you're forever 21 at the mall. But then, so Donnie waltz into who wrote Oh, I really good friend as well. That book blew my mind when I read it as a student. And then Monica West author of revival season. Yeah, Jamil. I mean, Jamal Brinkley and Jamil Jan Koshai. He wrote 99 Nights-

Traci Thomas 20:52

He also wrote he also wrote the collection-

Melissa Mogollon 20:54

The haunting of- Yeah, that's yes. He was my literary idol. He still is. But he's my literary idol. He was so cool in class. And those are my friends.

Traci Thomas 21:07

Those are my friends.

Melissa Mogollon 21:09

Sarah Mathews too, iconic, very talented.

Traci Thomas 21:12

That's, yeah, I've read that book, too. Wow. So many fancy people there was Kaveh teaching there when you were there? Akbar?

Melissa Mogollon 21:19

No, no, I wish Oh my God, I wish.

Traci Thomas 21:23

I would get an MFA just to go spend every day with him as my teacher and be like, oh, I need office hours. Like what do you like? Not in a sexy way. But just like, tell me about your dreams last night? Like, how what shoes are you wearing? I love I love your Vans. They're very cool. I love him. Okay, wait, I'm not done asking you about the book. You have these chapter titles that are in English and Spanish. And I'm curious why you did that. And also how you came up with the chapter titles. Because they're not like usually like chapter was like verbatim in the chapters, but I don't feel like these ones are.

Melissa Mogollon 21:59

So the chapter titles are typical sayings or commands that you hear from a Latina, like your aunt, your mom, your cousin. So they're kind of like traditional things in Latin American culture, they are not connected to the book at all, they were just fun for me to come up with. And they are saying that Luciana could have heard a different time from her mother or grandmother or aunts. And then I don't know, if you have the ARC or-

Traci Thomas 22:25

I don't, I have the finished.

Melissa Mogollon 22:26

Um, so the chapter number in the number, there's a little circle around it.

Traci Thomas 22:33

And It's the English translation.

Melissa Mogollon 22:36

First, they wanted to put it under, they want to put the English translation on was like in a shadow of the Spanish one. I didn't like and I wanted to give the Spanish title its moment and just let it be. Yeah. So I was like, What if we put it in a circle around the number never thinking they would let me do it. I like drew it up on paint on the phone on my computer. And then they're like, that actually looks kind of good. Maybe we'll go with that, great!

Traci Thomas 23:03

I love it. I read about half of the book. And I listened to about half of the book but not like the first half of the second half just kind of switched off. And I love the audiobook narrator but on the audiobook, they say the English title first and then they say the Spanish.

Melissa Mogollon 23:19

Are you dropping tea? I had no idea.

Traci Thomas 23:21

Yeah, I wonder if it's just because it's first on the page. Like it's higher up because it's with the number. But I thought that was really interesting because in the book, I felt like the Spanish chapter title was the thing. But then on this, it was like, Oh, is it English? And like, here's a translation. I don't speak Spanish. I can like it was like that. I was like, that's fine.

Melissa Mogollon 23:40

I mean, with the audiobook I kept, they were lovely. They were amazing. The producer, director and narrative, the audiobook were just so incredible. And they were kind and asking me my dreams, hopes and desires for the book. And I was like, this is your guys's book now like, I like to me, I'm gonna I'm excited to meet these characters is a whole separate version iteration of this world. So like go wild. So yeah, whatever they did works for them. But I'm not precious about I know, some writers are very precious about certain language. But I am like, if people had fun, that's all I cared about.

Traci Thomas 24:12

I think that the audio book Narrator did a really good job. It's sort of a hard left, because a lot of it is in the voice of the character. But then there's all these conversations that happen, which on the page are italicized, so like that, like the dialogue within the dialog appears italicized on the page, but then she sort of had to like give these other people voices, and I was like, damn, this is hard. And I thought you did a really lovely job. Okay, before we move on to your tastes and books and stuff, I do want to ask you a little bit about being a teacher at a boarding school. So the first question is, do you live on campus?

Melissa Mogollon 24:43

I do live on campus. I'm currently tuning in live from the top of our one of our upper classmen girl dorms.

Traci Thomas 24:49

Do you live in a dorm?

Melissa Mogollon 24:51

I live at the top level of our dorm or faculty apartments. So I do live here. Yes, I have the lacrosse field out my window here to the left.

Traci Thomas 24:59

And how long have you been at the school?

Melissa Mogollon 25:01

This will be my third year.

Traci Thomas 25:03

And did you always want to work in a boarding school? Or is this just what worked out for you? Or what's the vibe?

Melissa Mogollon 25:08

No, I didn't even know boarding schools really existed until I left Disney, throwing it back to Disney because I really wanted to finish this novel. And I did not have any time to write that year. And so I packed up my minivan and drove back to Florida and was like, I just need a minute to think of what my next move is. I used to have a minivan I was obsessed with it. Her name was Bertha Big Booty Bertha. But it was only because that was like my family's car that they very kindly gave to me. And then my dad was like, you can't keep driving the minivan to Disney. Like we need to do whatever it takes to get you a new car because it's a wrap. And so he was the one that then I got my got my grandfather's like very old car and said, but so I'm boarding school. So then my, my college roommate and bestie, I was talking to her and I said, I really want somewhere where I can live and where I can eat and have very small financial commitments and burdens, but I don't want it to be at home. And I know that's the only place that will do that. And she was like, Have you heard of boarding schools, you know, if you teach there, you get to live there, you can eat there. And it just might be what you need. They may want like an artist in residence or something. So I reached out to the boarding school, two weeks before the school year started. And I was like, This is what I can offer you. I will do anything literally anything if you give me housing and let me live here to write by the water. It's by the water.

Traci Thomas 26:27

I swear I'm not desperate. I'm not desperate. I'll do anything you want. But like I'm you also do want me like I'm not like bottom of the dregs or anything.

Melissa Mogollon 26:34

No, I totally was like I I'm very desperate capital D, whatever you want. And then they were like Iowa? Okay. Go. So yeah, I was able to live here part time, my first year, and I finished Oye. And I've lived on campus every time I've lived here because this is my second tour back. I left after for two years, and I'm back and I'm never leaving again. But it is it's not for everybody. It's definitely for me like I love coming home and seeing a kid really excited and asking about their day or you know, running into a kid who's crying and trying to make their day better. So I'm a people person, and I love kids. So it works for me. I live here with my partner too who doesn't work at the school.

Traci Thomas 27:11

I was going to ask you I knew that you're getting married. And I was I was the next question was Does your partner work at the school? And how does she feel about living with 500 of her favorite 16 to 19 year olds or whatever?

Melissa Mogollon 27:27

She is really firm on her boundaries. So it works. Like she said, we walk in and she's like, I can't I can't today and she'll run up. And because I'm like Vanessa No. And she's like, I just can't today. So she's really good. She as a lawyer is a she has a lot of similar hours to me. She works pretty hard. But she's the total softy. So like she'll go to their games. They'll always like keep on her game and then she'll she'll go Awesome.

Traci Thomas 27:51

Is she does she work from home? Or does she go to work?

Melissa Mogollon 27:55

She works from home and she'll go into the office in Boston, maybe like once every few weeks?

Traci Thomas 28:00

Wow, incredible. I could never what a lovely person she must be I would be like nope, I see a lacrosse field. I have got to get out of here if I wasn't a teacher.

Melissa Mogollon 28:12

We live by the water. I mean, she's so lucky I every day I'm like, you know, you're living your best life. She'll go play pickleball for four hours in the middle the day and then go to the beach and come home and she's good.

Traci Thomas 28:20

Okay, so she's fine. I don't have to worry about her. Um, you used to teach English. Now you're an administrator. And you're going back to teaching creative writing next year? Yes. Yes. What grade did you teach? And what did you assign? And what books were your students actually into? And which books did your students hate?

Melissa Mogollon 28:43

Okay, great question. So, when I was teaching English to sophomores, we, what was the first part of the question? I'm gonna answer the part.

Traci Thomas 28:51

What what did you assign? Like, what kind of stuff?

Melissa Mogollon 28:55

We had we started off with Ocean Voing's poetry collection night sky with exit wounds, which I thought was a great entry point for high schoolers to see contemporary poetry. And they loved it. They were like, ocean my boy by the end of it. They're like, the only guy that can make childbirth on depressing like they were just saying the funniest thing that we did. My Brother was an Aztec by Natalie Diaz. And they also love that then we did such a fun age by Kylie Reid, and she zoomed us so they were really excited. My favorite part is like when high schoolers they're not. When they talk about books. They're like, this should have been the ending instead. So they were giving Kylie a bunch of types of feedback.

Traci Thomas 29:39

That's honestly what I tried to tap into when I do book clubs. I'm like, this was bad. I hate it. Fix it.

Melissa Mogollon 29:45

Let's do this instead. No, they were shameless and I loved it. Then I did assign girl woman other by bernadina barista, I don't know if you've read it, but I really not read it but I know it. It kind of plays around with form so I was really interested in it, but we it was so long and it was the end of the Aaron, I was like, they're gonna cry if I sign this 400 page book right now. And then we did a lot of essays and excerpts and short stories throughout.

Traci Thomas 30:10

Do you have like books that you have to teach? Like, do you have to teach any of the class the quote unquote, classics.

Melissa Mogollon 30:17

So it's an independent school, like all boarding schools are independent. So you have kind of free range to teach whatever you want, which is why I really loved it and love this school. There are now some standards in the department of things they would like us to do. But I haven't really run into any sort of pushback. And so I just get to teach books I'm excited about.

Traci Thomas 30:37

And you're doing creative writing next year, first time with this class, they let you do this, I've heard. what are you going to teach?

Melissa Mogollon 30:46

So it's going to be a heavy, heavy writing class. So most of the material will be their own work. But when we hit genre, we're gonna do fiction, nonfiction, and then poetry. I'm gonna give them excerpts of things to look at. I really love how to write an autobiographical novel by Alexander chi. I love a lot of the essays in there. So I'm definitely gonna sign some of that a lot of Ross gay. I love assigning Ross gay to the kids, because it's a lot about joy. And I like showing them that, you know, writing doesn't always have to be depressing.

Traci Thomas 31:14

Yes, it does. Kids, it does. Fuck us up. Fuck us up.

Melissa Mogollon 31:19

But no, classics. Sometimes they're like, Miss Mogo, can we please do a classic? And I'm like, you're gonna get that from every other class. Don't worry, you guys are gonna be good.

Traci Thomas 31:29

Okay, this is sort of a question for later. But I have since we're here, I'll skip it later. If you had to assign one quote unquote, classic to your English students. What would you pick?

Melissa Mogollon 31:40

Catch 22. I think, Because I love the voice. I love Yasarian's voice the main character. I love the way that Joseph Heller, I feel like I'm blanking on the author's name, but I'm pretty sure that's the name.

Traci Thomas 31:55

That's right.

Melissa Mogollon 31:56

He just the way he wrote, I loved the idea of a little man being like taking war personally or thinking like, why are they trying to kill me? Which is that such thing? Like he's like, why are they shooting at me? Like I didn't do anything. So I felt that I like the humor and I it's very subtle humor. So I would love to teach that.

Traci Thomas 32:15

I never read it. You're making me want to read it. It's like to ask you this. I wasn't gonna because I think it's an insult. But I don't think it's an insult. So I want you to tell me if it's an insult. Okay, tell me is calling something voicy an insult? Because I called your book Voicy. But then I was like, Is that mean? It is voicy. But I wasn't sure because then you just said that you like the voice and catch 22? And I'm like, Well, that sounds like it's kind of wasting no, no, no, no one did I just sometimes I say things and then I'm like, Oh, is that a thing you're not supposed to say?

Melissa Mogollon 32:46

It's also very, very hard to offend me like a lot of the times. I'm so nerd divergent that I'm realizing people are being mean to me, and it's my partner who's constantly like, now that person has literally insulted you every time they've spoken to you like you need to quit it. So it's probably also from working with teenagers, like my threshold for insults is so high so high. I don't even bat an eyelash. So no, I think voice is great. I mean, I do think there is a stigma that calling things like I don't believe in it. But I do think that, like, any sort of condescending belittling term for women are like, voicing tea, whatever, like but I-

Traci Thomas 33:22

So that's what I was trying to get at. Is that like, is it a pejorative?

Melissa Mogollon 33:25

Maybe? I mean, I didn't personally take it that way. But I could see other people maybe thinking that.

Traci Thomas 33:31

Okay, I didn't. This is why I'm asking you because I'm like, I don't know. I don't know a lot of like, the literary like rules because I'm, I'm an outsider, like, I've come into your space. I like made a space for myself. But like there are definite no, there are there are things that people are like, Oh, Nina, and I wasn't sure if we see was one. But I mean it as a compliment is literally I think it's really hard to get into someone else's voice. And this book is super voicy because you've taken us fully into this child or like young woman's voice. But I mean, that's also just the kind of fiction that I like, I like when the main character is like with me, and I'm like, Oh, they have a very distinct specific voice in which they speak to me. So we do this thing every month where someone writes in and they ask for a book recommendation from us, and it's called Ask the stacks and the email, ask the stacks at the stacks podcast calm and they send us whatever, but this month, I have made a slight change because I just completed my nonfiction summer reading guide, and it's my obsession. And so what I'm going to do, I put together 35 bucks, okay, people can get it on Patreon or substack. But you didn't put together any books. So I'm gonna ask you for your most favorite two or three of your most favorite nonfiction books that you feel like are just totally unputdownable amazing books that was like the guide. That was like what was my guiding principle for my guide? It's 35 books that I think are just like fucking amazing. None of them have ever been featured on this podcast because I feel like sometimes I end up repeating the same books over and over. So I was like, the challenge is no books that we've ever done for book club or interview. So yes, what are your like most unputdownable nonfiction books.

Melissa Mogollon 35:30

I love how to do nothing by Jenny Odell. Might have been the time in my life and I read it where I really needed to do nothing. So it was lovely. And it hit and I think, has a lot of cool neurological research in it. I really love like I mentioned how to do nothing by Alex. Not you know, like how to write a graphic novel by Alexander Chee, adored, and the book of more delights by Ross Gay. I would say those three I really, really enjoy. In general, I love Nate like I do love nature. I can't remember the name. But there's a I mean, braiding sweetgrass, too, I did really love but anything that tells me about what how trees communicate or how animals in general communique is really fascinating to me. I'm a big animal person which is jarring for some people for sure. And I understand if you're not.

Traci Thomas 36:18

Do you have many animals? can you have animals at a boarding school?

Melissa Mogollon 36:21

I have a dog Her name is Dora.

Traci Thomas 36:24

Oh right, I knew that. She's she's she gets a lot in the acknowledgments just in case she can read. If you ever been able to read this is a huge paragraph.

Melissa Mogollon 36:35

and the best part is that she does not give a fuck about me or anything. Dora's like oh, she's doing it again. She hates when-. But no, I'm a big reason why I love Rhode Island is the nature and the tree. So I'm constantly like counting my significant other way too many fun facts about like possums or birds or coyotes or anything around me.

Traci Thomas 36:54

Did you read how far the light reaches by Sabrina Imbler?

Melissa Mogollon 36:57

No, I'm gonna write it down right now.

Traci Thomas 36:59

Oh my god. It's about sea creatures. And the book is it's actually spoiler. This is in my nonfiction summer reading guide. I call it a quote unquote literal beach read because I'm clever.

Melissa Mogollon 37:14

My mom's a marine biologist and my dad is a biologist so we grew up very nautical. I feel like by the age of like five years old, I had been around way too many sea animals.

Traci Thomas 37:26

You'll love this. So Sabrina Imbler. They take each it's an essay collection. And they take each essay is about a different sea creature. But it also is sort of a memoir. And they talk about their non binary they talked about that and like they're transitioning, you know what I actually don't know for sure what they identify as now because they have since like, you know, the as they progress through their gender journey, things have changed. And I'm sure it's changed since the book came out. But they talk about like sea creatures that are also non binary or like building queer communities. And they talk about like, Sabrina is mixed race so they talked about that. And they talk about being this outsider in this like, science journalism community, but they're using like deep sea crabs and like, anorexic octopus and shit, it's like incredible. It's incredible. I don't know if the octopus are anorexic, but I know that the octopus has to do with food. So I just added my own crazy.

Melissa Mogollon 38:21

That's amazing.

Traci Thomas 38:22

I think you'll love it. Yous old it. Yeah. Okay for people who are ready for us to get back to our regular scheduled ask the stacks you need to email us the stacks at the stacks podcast.com and send your questions for me and my guests and then I will stop making everything about me and I will let you guys be in charge. But not this month. Um, okay, now we get to the questionnaire. Two books you love one book you hate.

Melissa Mogollon 38:46

Okay, I love map of home by Rhonda Gerrar that was a huge inspiration for me writing Oye. And then I wrote how to do nothing and then the final revival of Opal & Nev by Donnie Walton to me stands out craft wise.

Traci Thomas 39:01

What do you hate? If you want to be fun, you better name names.

Melissa Mogollon 39:08

I honestly I couldn't think of a book I hated.

Traci Thomas 39:11

Not even something you were assigned in school. Not even something weird and random?

Melissa Mogollon 39:16

I hated everything I was assigned in school. I didn't really enjoy any Shakespeare I ever read.

Traci Thomas 39:23

Oh wow. You're not fun. Okay, I love Shakespeare. But you probably weren't assigned it good.

Melissa Mogollon 39:30

I also wasn't paying attention. It was Florida. No one's doing anything.

Traci Thomas 39:35

Yeah, and the teachers they don't be teaching that fun drama stuff. They're teaching like alliteration and I'm like, Romeo's literally talking shit to your face and you're over here telling me about a summer's day. I don't fucking care about any shit. I want to know why Romeo's a loser fuck boy say more.

Melissa Mogollon 39:53

It's really heartbreaking like how much we miss our kids with the good literature. It's terrible.

Traci Thomas 40:00

I don't I just don't understand like, is it because like the teachers sometimes are so far removed from the experience of being a teenager and what's exciting to a teenager? And so like, what they're interested in is not what the kids are interested in. Or do you think it has more to do with like, expectations or like like that you have to talk about alliteration at some point.

Melissa Mogollon 40:19

Yeah, I think they're just a lot of curriculums are pretty outdated and like it worked back then. I don't think it's working anymore. Benchmarks they need to meet in order to advance.

Traci Thomas 40:28

You mean, the curriculum works back then. But doesn't work anymore? Or like the benchmarks? Maybe? Both? What kind of reader would you say that you are?

Melissa Mogollon 40:39

A voicy reader I love definitely voice driven character driven books. I like the feeling of I want to open a book and feel like it's telling me get in the car. We're like driving high speed on the highway. That's how I want to feel I every time I read I skip any exposition and interiority any description, I cannot stand it that I hate. I fucking hate when people are like, in the window had this color and the tree and I cannot stand it in it because I can't do it. But I don't like it. I doesn't. I don't think it's bad writing. But I just have no interest in it. So I was like, this book is gonna be only dialogue. I also I always read the ending of a book before I get there always. pretty much always Yeah, I want to make sure I'm-

Traci Thomas 41:23

From the beginning. Or just like once you're halfway through, you're like what's going to happen and ending?

Melissa Mogollon 41:29

Great question. I'll read a few pages or the first chapter or first few chapters. And then once I kind of get an understanding of how things are in this world, I usually read the ending to see if it's like worth it for me to get to and to. I like to it becomes a richer experience for me to then knowing where we end up to then kind of like psycho analyze each interaction and each word and each sentence.

Traci Thomas 41:50

I've heard the same thing. Do you know Jason Reynolds? You know who that is? He's like a young adult writer. Anyways, but he was telling me he does that to be like three the ends of the books to see how the writers get there. Like, he likes to know so we can figure out like, it's like a puzzle for him. I don't like that. I want I want to be surprised when I get there. And if you give up too much information on the way I knew.

Melissa Mogollon 42:12

I hate surprises.

Traci Thomas 42:14

you do? All surprises?

Melissa Mogollon 42:17

I mean, unless it's like a birthday surprise. I love being spoiled and gifted on my birthday. But it's I don't like being caught off guard for things. Which is why I need visuals often.

Traci Thomas 42:27

Okay, what is the last really great book you read?

Melissa Mogollon 42:33

Headshot by Rita Bullwinkle. I read it recently.

Traci Thomas 42:36

Is it really great? I want to read it.

Melissa Mogollon 42:39

It is so rooted in like female athletes and their psyches and their quirks voicy It's weird. It is voicy but it almost feels like I'm getting the voice from up here instead of right here. Oh, it might be better for some people, but it's not like someone's screaming at you.

Traci Thomas 42:59

It's not like when you said up here she did a gesture she said up here with her hands above her head versus right here which was like next to her ear. I realized that this podcast I understood what you were saying but then I was like people at home are gonna be like, what does that mean? Give? Yeah, good catch. Okay, I really do want to read that I've heard it's really good. It sounds like you're similar to me as a reader that you really like like action plot you like for things to happen. You're not super into like just sitting with a moody person.

Melissa Mogollon 43:25

No, no, that will I will get lost so fast. And with people too. Again real life. Yeah.

Traci Thomas 43:33

Like I feel like a slow talker or something.

Melissa Mogollon 43:35

Oh my god. I like 99% of my friends. Vanessa is her talking and I do this. I'm like, hurrying her with my hand or I'm like, you get to the point. I already heard this already heard this. And she's like, You're so rude.

Traci Thomas 43:45

Sometimes I do the exact same thing to Mr. Stacks. Can you read multiple books at a time?

Melissa Mogollon 43:51

Yes, I can. I can. Do I finish them? I don't know. But like I'm I'm constantly reading like five at a time.

Traci Thomas 43:58

Oh, okay. And what are you reading right now?

Melissa Mogollon 44:01

Cinema Love. By Andy Tang.

Traci Thomas 44:09

Ah!

Melissa Mogollon 44:10

It is about this is the best logline ever. It's like a tale about the gay men in rural China in the 80s and the woman who marry them. It's so good.

Traci Thomas 44:21

Cinema Love, like a movie like cinema?

Melissa Mogollon 44:23

Yeah look up the cover. It's absolutely stunning.

Traci Thomas 44:27

Oh, yeah, I've seen this. I've seen it.

Melissa Mogollon 44:28

Yes. Then there is a Rio Grande in heaven by Ruben Reyes Jr. Which is a short story collection. Really excited about that. I have an early edition of it. I'm reading victim which I know you covered on your podcast and Andrew, he's the best. Looking up on my show. Oh, wait by Abriola Burnham Burnham. I'm just starting out this week. I'm so pumped. I'm doing an event with her next month. So yeah.

Traci Thomas 44:57

People who are listening to this episode who don't follow Have me on social media or like care about me at all? You might not know this, but our book club pick for this month is it ends with us by Colleen Hoover. Have you read it yet? We can tell people, have you finished it? I haven't read it yet.

Melissa Mogollon 45:13

Yes! And I've done so many interviews. What are you reading right now? And I've had to frickin bite my tongue each time because I was told it was going to be a surprise. So I was was not allowed to say it.

Traci Thomas 45:22

It is a surprise. But when this airs, people will know.

Melissa Mogollon 45:26

Yeah, it's been what I've been reading and I had to I bought it on paperback. I bought it on my phone for ebooks. And then I also have it on audiobook because that's how like I needed all the three formats have pushed me through to the finish line. So it's been taking up most of my reading time. And so it's it's really what's been on my mind, and I have not been able to talk about it for any interview.

Traci Thomas 45:47

Oh my gosh, okay, well, everybody, we're gonna talk about it. We're gonna get into it on June 26th back here on the podcast, we will spoil it. So if you're like, I don't want to read that you don't have to, you can just hear us tell you everything about it. But if you're like, I've been dying to read Colleen Hoover. But I actually also have not been dying to read Colleen Hoover. Now we have people to do it with. Now back to your life, your real reading life not imposed on you by me. How do you pick your next book? Whose recommendations do you trust? Do you ever use like print media or other outlets? Do you use people on the internet? Like sort of how do you find what to read?

Melissa Mogollon 46:30

Definitely through word of mouth of my friends who are writers, but also my friends who are not writers. I think I love kind of getting a lay of the land, see what everyone's reading. I always ask my students what they're reading. And part of my job is I'm on dorm duty, which means once a week at night, I'm posted up in the dorm for anything they need. And then right before I go to bed at 11, I have to go to each of the rooms and I say good night. Good night, night. Other times they have a book in bed. So I'm like, What do you read again? So that's sometimes I'll figure that out. But definitely through social media. I mean, Instagram has been such a cool place for me having the book come out. And I love seeing what people are reading and it's it's just opened up my eyes to a lot of other books.

Traci Thomas 47:12

who is your most trusted reading recommender?

Melissa Mogollon 47:17

There's a few but definitely, her name is Leticia and her account is bookshelf by LA. I just feel so on the same wavelength with her about so many things in life that like anything she recommends. I'm like, if she gets it, I get it. And we're there. She loves it. I love it. Same thing with JC underscore grin. I do think similar to him, I like I love the way he moves through the world. And so I do enjoy anything that he suggests.

Traci Thomas 47:48

We love him. Okay, also, what are the kids reading these days in bed at night? When you say goodnight to them?

Melissa Mogollon 47:55

They are reading a lot of sci fi will say like a lot of fantasy, a lot of sci fi it's not usually something I recognize. But recently the kids were reading come and get it by Kylie, which was sweet to see.

Traci Thomas 48:05

Did they like it?

Melissa Mogollon 48:07

They did. They did. I mean, I don't know if they would tell me they didn't. But they liked it.

Traci Thomas 48:12

I loved that book so much. I know some people didn't like it. But I'm like, Oh, you're wrong. It's great. It's my see. It's so voicy and I love it. And like people were like, Oh, nothing happens in that book. I'm like, What are you reading? What's in your copy? Is it like personal every telephone or each copy is different. There's three different versions. I'm like, there's so much happening. These telephone. I haven't read it, but I need to. But I just frickin I loved coming. I mean, I think I even told Kylie this when I saw her I liked it way more than such a fun age. I thought it was like sort of so much growth from her as like a storyteller. Did you feel like Did you see your life as a dorm liver in her- like, were you like, oh, this tracks? I know. It's high schoolers versus college.

Melissa Mogollon 49:00

yeah, for sure. I mean, and whenever I'm FaceTiming Kylie and I'll be like, once I have to go like a kids crying. She's like you have the best job in the world. I'm like, I know. Like what was that? I was like nothing. She just heard her friends talking about her at lunch. Like it's never it's just classic High School shit and yeah, I love creating a container for them to just like let it out because I'm like, I get it. I get it. I was there.

Traci Thomas 49:21

Oh my god. I couldn't I like just hearing your talk. I'm like you have to be patient with teenagers. Oh. Oh my god. You seem lovely. I wish you were my teacher though. I didn't live in a dorm in high school. I just had to live with my family. I so do you listen to audiobooks are you an audiobook person?

Melissa Mogollon 49:38

I do. We do a lot of road trips and we do road trips that will listen to audiobooks the last the last one I listened to was the one only one left by Riley Singers.

Traci Thomas 49:48

Yeah. Is that like a thriller?

Melissa Mogollon 49:50

It's a thriller, which was so different for me, but I was like, let's try this. One thing about audiobooks that I probably will never be normal to me is like the very animated character-like voicing of a lot of the characters. I have to it takes me a few chapters always to get over that. And then I'm in. But that's always a little difficult for me.

Traci Thomas 50:08

Do you listen at the at one speed or do you speed it up?

Melissa Mogollon 50:11

No yeah, I'm like 1.75.

Traci Thomas 50:15

I feel like that really helps. I feel like that makes everyone sound less animated. And they're just like talking so fast.

Melissa Mogollon 50:21

Yes, that happened to- Or when I was listening to Coho's book on audiobook, Colleen Hoover. I was like, let's go. Let's go.

Traci Thomas 50:29

Yeah. Do you and your partner have similar reading tastes?

Melissa Mogollon 50:33

No, Oh, my gosh. Well, she likes what I like, do I like what she likes? I don't know.

Traci Thomas 50:38

I think you do know, I think the answer is you don't like those books.

Melissa Mogollon 50:39

She was a big, I mean, I've just never read them. But she was very, they were just not even commercial. Because I love commercial books. But it was like a step up that she if she really likes Jodi Picoult which I like respect, but I've never actually read a lot of it. She loves Jodi Picoult she loves um I'm blanking on other names, but it's just the books that I never see really are talking about. And so when we combined our apartments I was like, Okay, you get this bookshelf and we hide it over here. Some people come over, they don't think those are my books.

Traci Thomas 51:15

How do you organize your books?

Melissa Mogollon 51:18

I see yours is very gorgeous and color coordinated which and so does my book is they have no organization. It's whatever I've left all over the coffee table. Vanessa will then put in the bookshelf because she hates the mess.

Traci Thomas 51:29

I have books all over the behind me as my organized books. But in front of me. It's just piles and piles of books that have no home. But I'm shocked that you don't do color if you're a visual person, because that's what I do color. I cannot remember a title or a name of an author. But if I see that cover, I'm like, Oh, I know exactly where the fuck that is.

Melissa Mogollon 51:46

Yes, it really is difficult in interviews. When they asked me to talk about books. I was like, Oh no, it's black in my head. It's dark and I don't know anything. But I'm not organized. I'm not an organized person. When it comes to my home life. I'm very organized at work and they call me organized all the time. And it drives Vanessa crazy because she's like, No, she's not she's so no everything's I like when things are just like blended.

Traci Thomas 52:09

I see. I'm not very organized in my home life either. But my books are organized because that is my work life. Like if my books were all over the place. I would like I can't find anything cannot work. Do you have a favorite bookstore?

Melissa Mogollon 52:23

I do. books and books in Miami, Florida.

Traci Thomas 52:27

And what is the last book you purchased?

Melissa Mogollon 52:30

I just bought The Skunks by Fiona Warnick. But she's a fellow Rhode Island debut author and she's the best and I can't wait to read it.

Traci Thomas 52:39

Last book that made you laugh.

Melissa Mogollon 52:41

I started I haven't finished it Good material by Dolly Alderton. I enjoyed the first chapter which is the protagonist, his list of the reasons why he's happy he broke up, or he got dumped by his girlfriend, which I found very entertaining.

Traci Thomas 52:55

Last book that made you cry.

Melissa Mogollon 52:58

This one was tough, too. And I this is a shitty answer. I'm sorry, but it was Oye. It was my own book when I was writing and finishing. I'm not really crier when it comes. Yeah, a lot of the books I read aren't too sad.

Traci Thomas 53:12

Okay, last book that made you angry.

Melissa Mogollon 53:14

I have some Questions for you by Rebecca Makkai. I think that's the name.

Traci Thomas 53:19

Why did it make you angry? What kind of angry?

Melissa Mogollon 53:22

I felt there were a lot of missed opportunities with like a lot of the racial undertones of the case of the book that were not. They didn't need to be explored or discussed, but at least acknowledged in the beginning of the book that I was like, This is so obvious.

Traci Thomas 53:37

right? What about the last book that you felt like you learned a lot?

Melissa Mogollon 53:43

Yellowface by RF Kuang. Because she talks so much about like publishing drama and just stereotypes in publishing. I'm not really in that world either. So it was really interesting. I was like, oh my god, do people do that? People think that.

Traci Thomas 54:00

Okay, how about a book that you feel embarrassed that you've never read?

Melissa Mogollon 54:06

I wrote all the classics for this answer.

Traci Thomas 54:10

Like, this is our theme today. All the classics. It's probably gonna end up being the episode title all the classics. Oh, hasn't read. I've not read most of the classics. I've read a handful. But mostly, no, but I have read every single Shakespeare play. Okay, yeah, so I got my bonus points there. Yeah. You picked. You made an enemy of me today. And um, what's a book that you wish more people read? Or like knew about?

Melissa Mogollon 54:40

Yes. It's called Fiebre Tropical.

Traci Thomas 54:43

Oh, I know this!

Melissa Mogollon 54:45

Okay, the voice is a young, queer Colombian girl from the Miami area and it was like, the first time I'd ever seen someone like me reflected back, but on top of that, it's a lot of Spanglish and the form is almost also similar to a monologue. So I was just very inspired and it felt like I had a friend in the literary world and it was just lovely. And I wish more people knew about it.

Traci Thomas 55:11

I love that. Okay, last question for you. If you could require the current president of the United States to read one book, what would it be?

Melissa Mogollon 55:19

I mean, my like cheeky answer right now would be Map of Home by Rhonda Girar because it is by Palestinian writer and would love to have Mr. Joe Biden read that. But I don't think enough people I don't know how you felt about how to do nothing by Jenny Odell, but Okay. So it's just really lovely explanation of what are different approaches we need to take to our brains and actually doing nothing and being anti this like crazy capitalist production-obsessed culture that we have a produce, produce produce, how that's really affecting our brains and like the act of for example, birdwatching, and actually just sitting, doing nothing, creates a possibility for everything. And so your brain starts actually creating new neurons and new pathways and more texture in there. So I would, I would love more people to think about that.

Traci Thomas 56:10

More people, specifically Joe?

Melissa Mogollon 56:13

More people specifically Joe again, though, some could, nevermind, yeah.

Traci Thomas 56:20

We're gonna leave it on that. Everybody, always out in the world. You can get it wherever you get your books. And you have to come back here on June 26th to hear Mel and I discuss Colleen Hoover. It Ends with Us. I can't believe we're doing this. I'll tell you guys next time how this all came to be. When we when Mel comes back and we talk about the book but I just want you all to know I'm I'm as shocked as you are that this is happening. And it's my fault. Do not blame Mel. It is my fault. She did not ask for this. But she has been given this life sometimes gives you things and you have to make Colleen Hoover lemonade or whatever.

Melissa Mogollon 57:02

And you buy the book in three different formats, because that's just what needs to happen. And I'm so excited. I hope people tune in. It's gonna be a roller coaster.

Traci Thomas 57:09

I'm gonna have a great time. Thank you so much for being here. And everybody else we will see you in the stacks.

All right, y'all. That does it for us today. Thank you so much for listening. And thank you to Melissa for being my guest. I'd also like to say a huge thank you to Andrea Pura for helping to make this conversation possible. Don't forget the Stacks book club pick for June is Colleen Hoover's It ends with us. We will be discussing the book on Wednesday, June 26th with Melissa Mogollon. If you love the show and you want inside access to it, head to patreon.com/thestacks to join The Stacks Pack and subscribe to my newsletter at TraciThomas.substack.com. Make sure you're subscribed to The Stacks wherever you listen to your podcasts and if you're listening through Apple podcasts or Spotify, be sure to leave a rating and a review. For more from The Stacks follow us on social media at thestackspod on Instagram, Threads and TikTok and at thestackspod_ on Twitter and you can check out my website at thestackspodcast.com. This episode of The Stacks was edited by Christian Dueñas, with production assistance from Lauren Tyree. Our graphic designer is Robin McCreight and our theme music is from Tagirijus. The Stacks is created and produced by me, Traci Thomas.

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